並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-09-%E6%BB%B4%E6%BB%B4%E7%AD%94%E7%AD%94-%E5%A4%A9%E7%A9%BA%E7%AB%B6%E6%8A%80%E5%A0%B4-%E5%90%89%E4%B8%83-%E5%9C%A8%E5%93%AA%E8%A3%A1-%E5%9F%BA%E9%9A%86%E5%82%B3%E5%A5%87%E7%A9%BA%E9%96%93%E6%9C%89%E6%B7%B7%E9%81%8E%E6%89%8D%E7%9F%A5%E9%81%93/id1544897518?i=1000525259081